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if Jesus loves... (Read 2,926 times)
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Re: if Jesus loves...
Reply #40 - Feb 27th, 2012 at 9:34am
 
Writers_Block wrote on Feb 27th, 2012 at 1:55am:
But you also hit on the very reason why he shouldn't be there in the bar-- for what Jesus was accused of doing in Matthew 11:19.

We are to avoid all appearance of evil.



So you're saying that Jesus shouldn't have visited, eaten, or drank with sinners because of the appearance of evil?   Huh
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Re: if Jesus loves...
Reply #41 - Feb 27th, 2012 at 9:18pm
 
Writers_Block wrote on Feb 27th, 2012 at 1:55am:
First of all, I asked if your pastor would be comfortable in a bar, not if you minded if he were there.

But you also hit on the very reason why he shouldn't be there in the bar-- for what Jesus was accused of doing in Matthew 11:19.

We are to avoid all appearance of evil.

is that the appearance of evil in others' eyes, or the appearance of evil an in things that might tempt us?
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Re: if Jesus loves...
Reply #42 - Feb 28th, 2012 at 12:35am
 
Quote:
is that the appearance of evil in others' eyes, or the appearance of evil an in things that might tempt us?


The first
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Re: if Jesus loves...
Reply #43 - Feb 28th, 2012 at 8:37pm
 
Writers_Block wrote on Feb 28th, 2012 at 12:35am:
The first

i believe that is a misreading of the text.
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Re: if Jesus loves...
Reply #44 - Feb 28th, 2012 at 11:33pm
 
Quote:
i believe that is a misreading of the text.


And you base that upon what?
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Re: if Jesus loves...
Reply #45 - Feb 29th, 2012 at 11:22pm
 
Writers_Block wrote on Feb 28th, 2012 at 11:33pm:
And you base that upon what?

first, the basic context of the verse (namely, I Thess. 5:22).
other translations could point out a clear picture without going into original languages.  for example, the NIV reads, "Avoid every kind of evil" (italics added). that's a far cry from avoiding other people from misperceiving/misinterpreting your actions.  even Jesus' actions had the appearance of evil in the associations He kept.

but if you do take a look at the Greek (OL), you'll find the word (eidos) is a word that seems to always mean the appearance as in something appearing.  for example, Jesus appearing before them.  or, active seeing (as opposed to passively being seen).
similarly, the word eidon is used in a verse like Acts 15:6 - to consider something or ponder on something.

prosopon, however, would be more of a word that would capture the idea of how something appears - it's outward appearance to someone observing.
Mt. 16:3 referring to the appearance of the sky, uses this word.
Gal. 2:6 likewise uses this word for judging the outward appearance (in fact, this is the clinching issue... God does not judge by outward appearances - prosopon).

one of the major points in the NT is that outward appearances of what we do aren't important; they weren't important for Jesus, for example.  they also weren't important to Paul who had a sharp disagreement with Peter over that exact issue.  it's the inward that matters.
spirit and in truth, and all that.
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Re: if Jesus loves...
Reply #46 - Mar 1st, 2012 at 9:37am
 
Writers_Block wrote on Feb 26th, 2012 at 2:39am:
Not saying that, but you have to avoid all appearance of sin as well.


Do you?  Based on who's perception of what is "sin"?

Quote:
If I see someone I need to talk to about the Lord, I won't stand outside with my nose pressed up against the window, but I will ask him to come out and "have coffee" elsewhere. Besides, it's hard talking about the Lord with someone in that environment. It's loud, it's noisy, it's riotous.


I think C.S. Lewis and his ilk would disagree, seeing as he met with Christian friends in pubs regularly to discuss the Lord.

Quote:
He created us for His own purpose.

"whom I created for my glory" - Isaiah 43:7 [quote]

And for what purpose is that?

[quote]In 1 Corinthians 10:31 we read, "So whether you eat or drink or whatever you do, do it all for the glory of God."


Why?

Quote:
God is sovereign, meaning that He is completely independent. He did not need to create us. He does not need us for anything. Based on this we might come to the conclusion that we are not important to God... that we are not needed and we have no purpose. But, that's not the end of the story. God tells us in Scripture that we were created to glorify Him. That's our purpose and that means we are important to Him personally.


If God loves us, we are certainly important to him; that's intrinsic to love.  But why is our purpose to glorify God?

Quote:
We were created to glorify God...

"I will praise you, O Lord my God,
with all my heart;
I will glorify your name forever."
- Psalm 86:12


That verse doesn't support your statement any more than Judas's intention to betray Jesus means that we should all betray Jesus.  David's intention to glorify God is not a command to glorify God.

Quote:
We were created to enjoy God...


Absolutely.

Quote:
As a result of our glorifying God, we find that we enjoy God and delight in knowing God. The Bible says that we were also created to be filled with joy. Jesus said, "I came that they may have life, and have it abundantly." - John 10:10


Okay.  But why?

Quote:
Psalm 16:11 tells us, "In your [God's] presence there is fulness of joy, in Your [God's] right hand are pleasures for evermore."


Of course.

Quote:
“In commanding us to glorify Him, God is inviting us to enjoy Him.” - C.S. Lewis

And God rejoices in us...

As a result of our glorifying God and enjoying Him, God in turn rejoices over us. Isaiah 62:5 says, "so shall your God rejoice over you."


Yes.

Quote:
A prophecy in Zephaniah tells us that God "will rejoice over you with gladness, He will renew you in His love; He will exalt over you with loud singing as on a day of festival." - Zephaniah 3:17-18


Yup, again.

Quote:
What does it mean to glorify God? How do we glorify God? It means to bring Him honor through what we say, how we act, and how we think. To glorify God means to acknowledge His glory and to value it above all things. To glorify God means we make it known to others. To glorify God means we have a heartfelt gratitude. We glorify God through our faith (trust). We glorify God through our love. We glorify God through our desire to obey Him (our obedience). We glorify God through our desire to know Him.


But why?
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Re: if Jesus loves...
Reply #47 - Mar 1st, 2012 at 9:38am
 
Writers_Block wrote on Feb 27th, 2012 at 1:55am:
First of all, I asked if your pastor would be comfortable in a bar, not if you minded if he were there.

But you also hit on the very reason why he shouldn't be there in the bar-- for what Jesus was accused of doing in Matthew 11:19.

We are to avoid all appearance of evil.


Ironically, you seem to be aligning yourself with those who accused Jesus of sinning.
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