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Question about Judaism. (Read 1,432 times)
patrick2
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Question about Judaism.
Apr 25th, 2012 at 6:07pm
 
I've wondered about this a long time.  Most religions are universal - ie, they speak to all humanity, eg Christianity, Islam, Buddhism.

Now, to a jewish person, what is God's relationship to people who aren't jewish?  God seems to have prescribed all kinds of rules for jewish people, but (under judaism) what is everyone else supposed to do?  Eg, do the Ten Commandments apply to them, too?
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jeff
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Re: Question about Judaism.
Reply #1 - Apr 26th, 2012 at 1:16am
 
not sure what you're really asking here... no religion has rules set out for non-adherents. 

i believe that if someone is observing the rule prescriptions detailed in the Torah, then they would categorically be Jewish and God's people since those are the covenantal stipulations.
at the very least they would be considered God-fearers.
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patrick2
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Re: Question about Judaism.
Reply #2 - Apr 26th, 2012 at 10:32pm
 
Quote:
not sure what you're really asking here... no religion has rules set out for non-adherents. 

i believe that if someone is observing the rule prescriptions detailed in the Torah, then they would categorically be Jewish and God's people since those are the covenantal stipulations.
at the very least they would be considered God-fearers.


Jewish people say that a jew is someone born from a jewish mother.  Although conversion to Judaism is possible, I understand it definitely is not encouraged,  Compare that to the evangelistic spirit of both Christianity and Islam.  As for non-adherents, Christianity says that they are DOOMED.  It's crystal clear from Christianity that it is addressed to the whole world, whereas Judaism seems to be tightly focussed on Jews.
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patrick2
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Re: Question about Judaism.
Reply #3 - Apr 26th, 2012 at 10:34pm
 
patrick2 wrote on Apr 26th, 2012 at 10:32pm:
Jewish people say that a jew is someone born from a jewish mother.  Although conversion to Judaism is possible, I understand it definitely is not encouraged,  Compare that to the evangelistic spirit of both Christianity and Islam.  As for non-adherents, Christianity says that they are DOOMED.  It's crystal clear from Christianity that it is addressed to the whole world, whereas Judaism seems to be tightly focussed on Jews.


I think it's a simple question:  Under Judaism, what is God's attitude toward non-jews?
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Re: Question about Judaism.
Reply #4 - Apr 27th, 2012 at 3:45pm
 
patrick2 wrote on Apr 26th, 2012 at 10:32pm:
Jewish people say that a jew is someone born from a jewish mother.  Although conversion to Judaism is possible, I understand it definitely is not encouraged,  Compare that to the evangelistic spirit of both Christianity and Islam.  As for non-adherents, Christianity says that they are DOOMED.  It's crystal clear from Christianity that it is addressed to the whole world, whereas Judaism seems to be tightly focussed on Jews.


Conversion to Judaism is not discouraged, although proselytization isn't necessarily encouraged either.

The Hebrew scripture makes it clear that God is the God of all the earth.  His relationship with the descendants of Abraham is not just just for their own sake:

"I will make you into a great nation,
    and I will bless you;
I will make your name great,
    and you will be a blessing.
I will bless those who bless you,
    and whoever curses you I will curse;
and all peoples on earth
    will be blessed through you."

Genesis 12:2-3
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Re: Question about Judaism.
Reply #5 - Apr 27th, 2012 at 6:01pm
 
Mercy For All wrote on Apr 27th, 2012 at 3:45pm:
Conversion to Judaism is not discouraged, although proselytization isn't necessarily encouraged either.

The Hebrew scripture makes it clear that God is the God of all the earth.  His relationship with the descendants of Abraham is not just just for their own sake:

"I will make you into a great nation,
    and I will bless you;
I will make your name great,
    and you will be a blessing.
I will bless those who bless you,
    and whoever curses you I will curse;
and all peoples on earth
    will be blessed through you."

Genesis 12:2-3


One of the problems I have in trying to talk to religionists is that they seem to rely on internal ambiguous jargon and won't give you a straight answer.

Under Judaism, does God want everyone to obey the Ten Commandments?  Does He want everyone to obey the kosher laws?
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Re: Question about Judaism.
Reply #6 - Apr 27th, 2012 at 10:22pm
 
patrick2 wrote on Apr 27th, 2012 at 6:01pm:
One of the problems I have in trying to talk to religionists is that they seem to rely on internal ambiguous jargon and won't give you a straight answer.

Under Judaism, does God want everyone to obey the Ten Commandments?  Does He want everyone to obey the kosher laws?


Speaking as an "outsider," no, he doesn't.  The Mosaic Covenant defines God's specific relationship with his people--defining them as distinct in the world.  The expectation of Judaism is for his people to be a model to demonstrate to the world the "proper way to live," and that the rest of the world will sooner or later come around.  I fully anticipate that sooner or later Moishe3rd will pop in to correct and/or clarify.

There are, however, clearly expectations that God has for "nations of the world" and he does judge them according to his expectations of justice.  Note that this is far more general than the specifics of kosher law, etc.  Expectations of other nations and God's judgment of those nations are demonstrated clearly in prophetic writings like Amos, Isaiah, and Obadiah.
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Re: Question about Judaism.
Reply #7 - Apr 27th, 2012 at 10:39pm
 
Mercy For All wrote on Apr 27th, 2012 at 10:22pm:
Speaking as an "outsider," no, he doesn't.  The Mosaic Covenant defines God's specific relationship with his people--defining them as distinct in the world.  The expectation of Judaism is for his people to be a model to demonstrate to the world the "proper way to live," and that the rest of the world will sooner or later come around.  I fully anticipate that sooner or later Moishe3rd will pop in to correct and/or clarify.

There are, however, clearly expectations that God has for "nations of the world" and he does judge them according to his expectations of justice.  Note that this is far more general than the specifics of kosher law, etc.  Expectations of other nations and God's judgment of those nations are demonstrated clearly in prophetic writings like Amos, Isaiah, and Obadiah.


Why, again according to Judaism, would God mysteriously select one desert tribe out for "special treatment", and have lower standards for everyone else?  Why have jews suffered so greatly at the hands of other people for centuries?
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Re: Question about Judaism.
Reply #8 - Apr 28th, 2012 at 10:11am
 
patrick2 wrote on Apr 27th, 2012 at 10:39pm:
Why, again according to Judaism, would God mysteriously select one desert tribe out for "special treatment", and have lower standards for everyone else?  Why have jews suffered so greatly at the hands of other people for centuries?


It's not about "special treatment" as if Israel was an arbitrary choice.  They were "God's people" before they were Israel or a nation--it is God's fulfillment of his promise to Abraham.  Why have they suffered?  It's kind of like, to whom much is given much is expected.  Jews today still argue about whether being God's people is more a blessing or a curse.
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Re: Question about Judaism.
Reply #9 - Apr 28th, 2012 at 12:17pm
 
Mercy For All wrote on Apr 28th, 2012 at 10:11am:
It's not about "special treatment" as if Israel was an arbitrary choice.  They were "God's people" before they were Israel or a nation--it is God's fulfillment of his promise to Abraham.  Why have they suffered?  It's kind of like, to whom much is given much is expected.  Jews today still argue about whether being God's people is more a blessing or a curse.

I am sure that deep down you think that the whole thing is inane.
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