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jeff

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Re: What is the nature of hell?
Reply #40 - May 13^th, 2012 at 8:10pm

patrick2 wrote on May 13^th, 2012 at 4:52pm:

Agnostics don't "decide to be separate from God", they don't know if God exists.

This is like what you're saying:

I say "Let's take a trip to Slobovia".

You say "Slobovia? Where's that? I don't know if it exists."

I say "You're deliberately separating yourself from Slobovia!" Grin

actually, it's like saying

-there's a right way to live because there's a God who will hold us accountable for our actions.

-but i don't know if there is a God

-i guess your conscience still points to the right way to live and there are lots of examples in history that demonstrate a right life towards others.

-but i don't know if there's a God so i don't think i will bother with the right way to live. i think i'll just be selfish.

-hmmmmm... i think i want to spend a lot more time with you!

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DV

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Re: What is the nature of hell?
Reply #41 - May 13^th, 2012 at 10:37pm

Quote:

no, you didn't read it. the discussion has been about choice about being with God or not.
so if you consider being separate from God to be eternal torment, then yes, you are choosing eternal torment when you decide to be separate from God.

but of course you read that already so you already knew it. Roll Eyes

Let's say that your god-theory is true and that someone else's is false -- or, that your's is false and that someone else's is true. In any event, when the "non-believer" (i.e., the "wrong one") meets the "true" god, what's to stop him/her from then saying: "yes, I'd like to have a relationship with you, great one" ?

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jeff

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Re: What is the nature of hell?
Reply #42 - May 13^th, 2012 at 11:25pm

DV wrote on May 13^th, 2012 at 10:37pm:

Let's say that your god-theory is true and that someone else's is false -- or, that your's is false and that someone else's is true. In any event, when the "non-believer" (i.e., the "wrong one") meets the "true" god, what's to stop him/her from then saying: "yes, I'd like to have a relationship with you, great one" ?

that's a great question. and i would say that's up to God, wouldn't you?

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DV LNF Representative2 Online RELIGION IS BLISS Posts: 1,665 Gender:	Re: What is the nature of hell? Reply #43 - May 14^th, 2012 at 7:27am Quote: that's a great question. and i would say that's up to God, wouldn't you? Your response side-steps your "choice" theory. IOW, my point is that choosing the wrong god-path is not the equivalent of choosing eternal torment.
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jeff

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Re: What is the nature of hell?
Reply #44 - May 14^th, 2012 at 7:14pm

DV wrote on May 14^th, 2012 at 7:27am:

Your response side-steps your "choice" theory. IOW, my point is that choosing the wrong god-path is not the equivalent of choosing eternal torment.

it isn't side-stepping anything. you would have me decide who "goes to hell" or not. but then you're critical when people decide who "goes to hell" or not.

it's not for people to decide that. so why engage in hypothesizing it.

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DV

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Re: What is the nature of hell?
Reply #45 - May 15^th, 2012 at 2:35pm

Quote:

it isn't side-stepping anything. you would have me decide who "goes to hell" or not. but then you're critical when people decide who "goes to hell" or not.

it's not for people to decide that. so why engage in hypothesizing it.

Wrong.

As you've acknowledged, a god decides this. People do not choose it, and it's absurd to say that they do.

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Mercy For All

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Re: What is the nature of hell?
Reply #46 - May 15^th, 2012 at 4:03pm

DV wrote on May 15^th, 2012 at 2:35pm:

Wrong.

As you've acknowledged, a god decides this. People do not choose it, and it's absurd to say that they do.

Pretty black and white.

This is what you're misrepresenting:

That people have a choice to live God's way or not. If you "don't know" God's way, you're still making a choice, even out of ignorance (there are many analogies that can be used to describe this). Whether or not somebody chooses correctly is something that God evaluates; not us.

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DV

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Re: What is the nature of hell?
Reply #47 - May 15^th, 2012 at 11:35pm

Mercy For All wrote on May 15^th, 2012 at 4:03pm:

Pretty black and white.

This is what you're misrepresenting:

That people have a choice to live God's way or not. If you "don't know" God's way, you're still making a choice, even out of ignorance (there are many analogies that can be used to describe this). Whether or not somebody chooses correctly is something that God evaluates; not us.

You're disguising nonsense with a lot of words.

Do you really think that people knowingly "choose" to go to "hell?"

KISS

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Mercy For All LNF Moderator The Writer's Croft LNF Bunker Offline Be completely alive until you're completely dead. Posts: 36,908 Gender:	Re: What is the nature of hell? Reply #48 - May 16^th, 2012 at 12:23pm DV wrote on May 15^th, 2012 at 11:35pm: You're disguising nonsense with a lot of words. Do you really think that people knowingly "choose" to go to "hell?" KISS No. People choose to reject God. Existence without God is helll. I've articulated that all before on this thread.
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DV LNF Representative2 Online RELIGION IS BLISS Posts: 1,665 Gender:	Re: What is the nature of hell? Reply #49 - May 16^th, 2012 at 4:34pm Mercy For All wrote on May 16^th, 2012 at 12:23pm: No. People choose to reject God. Existence without God is helll. I've articulated that all before on this thread. People do not knowingly reject a god. What they reject is an unsubstantiated/unproven claim that is made by a man.
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