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Normal Topic Intersesting sermon from a Post Millenielist. (Read 1,350 times)
fair-minded know it all
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Intersesting sermon from a Post Millenielist.
Jan 12th, 2016 at 3:19pm
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I heard this sermon and it got me thinking, maybe forcing me to reconsider my eschatology.   My understanding of end times has always been that Christ will build His Church and the world and it's Kingdoms/governments will always, for the most part reject Christ and grow worst.
This guys interpretation is much more optimistic, the Kingdom of God growing, influencing and finally triumphing before the 2nd coming.  This is his interpretation of course, but he goes through scripture seeming to make a good case.   

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C1QKum419MU   


  

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Re: Intersesting sermon from a Post Millenielist.
Reply #1 - Jan 12th, 2016 at 4:01pm
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I plan on watching that, maybe this evening. I was always a premillennialist until I was taking a theological course and read a book on millennialism. The unique (for met at that time) feature of that book was that each position was actually represented by a proponent of that position! It didn't reverse my perspective but it certainly forced me to consider the other perspectives more seriously and hold less strongly to my own.

That said (not having watched it yet), I really don't think "we" will "mostly get the job done" only to have Jesus come in at the last to seal the deal...
  

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Re: Intersesting sermon from a Post Millenielist.
Reply #2 - Jan 12th, 2016 at 9:23pm
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Mercy For All wrote on Jan 12th, 2016 at 4:01pm:
That said (not having watched it yet), I really don't think "we" will "mostly get the job done" only to have Jesus come in at the last to seal the deal...


Yeah, I definitely would be interested on your take on this.
I guess it's not so much about the timing of events that got me interested in his position, but the thrust of the NT proclamation concerning the Kingdom.  He stresses that the main message is not our individual salvation from Hell and ticket to Heaven, but the fact that all authority has been given to Christ on Heaven and Earth. That the kingdom has come and is growing and will triumph. 
He says it affects our witness in the world.  If our eschatology is that the world gets worst then we tend to rejoice in the increase in sin instead of engaging and being light and salt.   In other worlds let the world go to Hell and wait for our rapture escape pod.
I'm not totally convinced of this position, but it got me thinking.
  

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Re: Intersesting sermon from a Post Millenielist.
Reply #3 - Jan 12th, 2016 at 9:40pm
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fair-minded know it all wrote on Jan 12th, 2016 at 9:23pm:
Yeah, I definitely would be interested on your take on this.
I guess it's not so much about the timing of events that got me interested in his position, but the thrust of the NT proclamation concerning the Kingdom.  He stresses that the main message is not our individual salvation from Hell and ticket to Heaven, but the fact that all authority has been given to Christ on Heaven and Earth. That the kingdom has come and is growing and will triumph. 
He says it affects our witness in the world.  If our eschatology is that the world gets worst then we tend to rejoice in the increase in sin instead of engaging and being light and salt.   In other worlds let the world go to Hell and wait for our rapture escape pod.
I'm not totally convinced of this position, but it got me thinking.


I'm three quarters of the way through. I really like the way he treats the Psalms, Isaiah, etc.--very Jewishly Messianic. Very...N.T. Wright...
  

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Re: Intersesting sermon from a Post Millenielist.
Reply #4 - Jan 12th, 2016 at 9:47pm
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Mercy For All wrote on Jan 12th, 2016 at 9:40pm:
I'm three quarters of the way through. I really like the way he treats the Psalms, Isaiah, etc.--very Jewishly Messianic. Very...N.T. Wright...


Yeah, I thought of you, since you've made statements that sounded similar in the past.
  

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Re: Intersesting sermon from a Post Millenielist.
Reply #5 - Jan 13th, 2016 at 12:59pm
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I listened to the whole thing. I like a lot of what he says about the "expanding kingdom" but (as I said before) I think it's a stretch to conclude that the Church will "triumph" before Christ's return. I would see it more like Christ's return validates and vindicates the Church's action and existence in the same way that Jesus' resurrection validated and vindicated all his prior actions, teachings, etc., all the way up to and including his crucifixion (in a culture in which the crucifixion itself would have disqualified a would-be messiah).
  

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Re: Intersesting sermon from a Post Millenielist.
Reply #6 - Jan 13th, 2016 at 1:09pm
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Thanks for listening and giving me your take on it. 
I guess my objections are the many texts that seem to speak of the conquering Messiah coming in power bringing peace and justice. It seems a stretch to spiritualize these text as only meaning Christ will rule and conquer from above.
  

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Re: Intersesting sermon from a Post Millenielist.
Reply #7 - Jan 13th, 2016 at 1:21pm
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fair-minded know it all wrote on Jan 13th, 2016 at 1:09pm:
Thanks for listening and giving me your take on it. 
I guess my objections are the many texts that seem to speak of the conquering Messiah coming in power bringing peace and justice. It seems a stretch to spiritualize these text as only meaning Christ will rule and conquer from above.


I agree completely. We are strongly informed by the concept of "separation of Church and State."
  

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