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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Do You Believe In God Or Creator? (Read 12,513 times)
Seawolf
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Re: Do You Believe In God Or Creator?
Reply #210 - Feb 15th, 2018 at 7:14pm
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Again, you have faith in something you can not see or recreate to validate your theory regarding life.  You HAVE to take the words of those who theorize.  Since you personally have never seen life come from nothing, all you have is faith
  


"Without morals a republic cannot subsist any length of time; they therefore who are decrying the Christian religion, whose morality is so sublime and pure (and) which insures to the good eternal happiness, are undermining the solid foundation of morals, the best security for the duration of free governments."

Charles Carroll, signer of the DOI
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Re: Do You Believe In God Or Creator?
Reply #211 - Feb 15th, 2018 at 7:15pm
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EF wrote on Feb 14th, 2018 at 11:35am:
Certainly not all who believe he's a historical figure believe that he is the Son of God.


Indeed.  For starters, there are ~1.5 billion Muslims who believe he was a historical figure but not the Son of God.
  

"If cousins, I would much prefer to marry one my Neanderthal relatives than a screeching chimpanzee which might bite my face off as has happened recently. Of course, chimps are not even a human species so procreation between humans and chimps is out of the question." - joe_christian, on sex
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Re: Do You Believe In God Or Creator?
Reply #212 - Feb 16th, 2018 at 4:15am
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Running Deer wrote on Feb 15th, 2018 at 7:15pm:
Indeed.  For starters, there are ~1.5 billion Muslims who believe he was a historical figure but not the Son of God.



There are close to 5 billion non-Christians in the world, IE people who don't believe in the divinity of Jesus.
  

Queshank wrote on Oct 25th, 2018 at 9:13am:
FC,

I've been thinking about how I can respond conversationally without coming across as a total dick.

Queshank
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Re: Do You Believe In God Or Creator?
Reply #213 - Feb 16th, 2018 at 12:19pm
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Yet we do not concern ourselves about how many do not believe.  The Bible clearly states few will believe so I do not worry about what a majority of people believe, has no relevance one way or the other.
  


"Without morals a republic cannot subsist any length of time; they therefore who are decrying the Christian religion, whose morality is so sublime and pure (and) which insures to the good eternal happiness, are undermining the solid foundation of morals, the best security for the duration of free governments."

Charles Carroll, signer of the DOI
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EF
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Re: Do You Believe In God Or Creator?
Reply #214 - Feb 16th, 2018 at 12:34pm
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Semi-Omnipotent wrote on Feb 15th, 2018 at 11:18am:
You're still confused..  the 'faith' I have in life spontaneously arising is the same as the 'faith" I have in the chemical reaction that produces a flame when I strike a match on the side of the box .

It is not at all like the lack of evidence you require for religious "Faith" ..



Again you're completely wrong.. We are moving closer each year to producing life in the laboratory. 

U.S. scientists take step toward creating artificial life.


It's simply a matter of time before the "formula" for life is known..



No.. What you see around you is the result of accidents (mutations) over millions and millions of years.. 

Life appears designed because it so intimately meshes with the environment that favored some accidents (mutations) and was hostile to others..   Evolution is an elegant, infallible step by step process where natural selection mates an organism with it's surroundings.   

You may not understand the covalent bond holding hydrogen to oxygen to produce water but because you don't understand it does not mean that an intelligence designed the mechanism.  In other words.. for things to be simply complex beyond your comprehension is not evidence of design. It is evidence of your limited understanding.


Maybe, but there's still gonna be a "creator" - in this case, the scientists.

That something as complex as the world we see around us could just "happen" is akin to believing a meal or a cake could emerge from a pile of ingredients absent a cook mixing them.

But it's a tiresome discourse and generally only conducted with what I call "evangelical atheists."  The faith that begets belief is a gift of God (that's in Ephesians).  Why He chooses to give it to some and not all is beyond my pay grade.
« Last Edit: Feb 16th, 2018 at 3:17pm by EF »  

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EF
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Re: Do You Believe In God Or Creator?
Reply #215 - Feb 16th, 2018 at 12:35pm
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Seawolf wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 12:19pm:
Yet we do not concern ourselves about how many do not believe.  The Bible clearly states few will believe so I do not worry about what a majority of people believe, has no relevance one way or the other.


The Book always speaks of a "remnant," and a remnant always implies less than half.  Generally MUCH less.
  

non sumus stulti
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Re: Do You Believe In God Or Creator?
Reply #216 - Feb 16th, 2018 at 6:24pm
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Seawolf wrote on Feb 15th, 2018 at 7:14pm:
Again, you have faith in something you can not see or recreate to validate your theory regarding life.  You HAVE to take the words of those who theorize.  Since you personally have never seen life come from nothing, all you have is faith


Slight correction here.  Yes, no one has seen life come from "nothing".   The position is scientists do not yet know the exact combination of chemicals/time/environment that causes what we call "life" from precursor elements.  That said there are some very telling experiments that have happened.

You are actually the one with the claim with no evidence.  You claim that life comes from nothing by a creator.  That's faith.  The burden of evidence is certainly on you to both prove the existence of a creator and that life came from that creator, and not only that but your particular version of a creator that contradicts other versions of creators.

Saying I don't know, or we don't know yet is not in any circumstances "faith".

This is completely an argument from ignorance - "We don't know what causes storms so it must be a creator." 



  
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Re: Do You Believe In God Or Creator?
Reply #217 - Feb 16th, 2018 at 6:33pm
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EF wrote on Feb 16th, 2018 at 12:34pm:
Maybe, but there's still gonna be a "creator" - in this case, the scientists.

That something as complex as the world we see around us could just "happen" is akin to believing a meal or a cake could emerge from a pile of ingredients absent a cook mixing them.

But it's a tiresome discourse and generally only conducted with what I call "evangelical atheists."  The faith that begets belief is a gift of God (that's in Ephesians).  Why He chooses to give it to some and not all is beyond my pay grade.


Except no one is saying that something as complex as the world just "happened" or an accident.

Complexity can arise just following a simple set of rules.  Evolution is the opposite of an accident.

Entropy increases on average but the whole solar system is evidence of a slight decrease in entropy.  That's why it's here! A cake that put itself together right before our eyes.




  
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