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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Hurricane Mueller is closing in on the White House! (Read 697 times)
Greg55_99
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Re: Hurricane Mueller is closing in on the White House!
Reply #30 - Sep 11th, 2017 at 10:53am
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Seawolf wrote on Sep 11th, 2017 at 10:52am:
Here we are in Sept and STILL no links of Russia to Trump.  I suspect Mueller will find something else to pin on Trump but I have said all along there simply is nothing to the Russia Trump claim.


OH, so that email thingie with Trump Jr means nothing,... right?

Greg
  

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Re: Hurricane Mueller is closing in on the White House!
Reply #31 - Sep 11th, 2017 at 11:01am
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Willy᾿s Wonka wrote on Sep 11th, 2017 at 10:53am:
We pause this thread for a moment as Trump's water bearers search for bigger buckets.



Don't worry, SW has a tanker truck.
  

Non sequitur:

Rodney Your Teas Ready wrote on Mar 2nd, 2017 at 4:30am:
... that has less power than a hair dryer used by a eunuch.



Rabbit_Reborn wrote on Feb 5th, 2017 at 5:40pm:
...that makes me a moron.
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forgotten centrist
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Re: Hurricane Mueller is closing in on the White House!
Reply #32 - Sep 11th, 2017 at 11:54am
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glen65 wrote on Sep 11th, 2017 at 10:23am:
The president said he fired him. But Trump didn't actually say he did it in order to shut the investigation down. Simply firing Comey wouldn't shut it down anyway. 


Lester Holt asked Trump why he fired Comey.  Trump's reply was something like "...this Russia thing is fake news".

That has been widely understood to be "I fired Comey because of the Russia investigation".  If you are arguing legal semantics, there is probably lots of wiggle room in there to squeeze whatever meaning you want out of it.  But if you are listening and understanding context, the meaning is very clear.

Trump did the interview in the direct aftermath of firing Comey.  He knew the question would come up.  This wasn't gotcha journalism. 

"And in fact, when I decided to just do it, I said to myself -- I said, you know, this Russia thing with Trump and Russia is a made-up story. It's an excuse by the Democrats for having lost an election that they should've won."

He had his letter from Rosenstein with its recommendations, but he said he would have fired Comey regardless of Rosenstein, because of "this Russia thing".
  

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Re: Hurricane Mueller is closing in on the White House!
Reply #33 - Sep 11th, 2017 at 11:57am
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forgotten centrist wrote on Sep 11th, 2017 at 11:54am:
Lester Holt asked Trump why he fired Comey.  Trump's reply was something like "...this Russia thing is fake news".

That has been widely understood to be "I fired Comey because of the Russia investigation".  If you are arguing legal semantics, there is probably lots of wiggle room in there to squeeze whatever meaning you want out of it.  But if you are listening and understanding context, the meaning is very clear.

Trump did the interview in the direct aftermath of firing Comey.  He knew the question would come up.  This wasn't gotcha journalism. 

"And in fact, when I decided to just do it, I said to myself -- I said, you know, this Russia thing with Trump and Russia is a made-up story. It's an excuse by the Democrats for having lost an election that they should've won."

He had his letter from Rosenstein with its recommendations, but he said he would have fired Comey regardless of Rosenstein, because of "this Russia thing".


That asshole can make all the gaffes he wants. They'll always deny he did.
  

Non sequitur:

Rodney Your Teas Ready wrote on Mar 2nd, 2017 at 4:30am:
... that has less power than a hair dryer used by a eunuch.



Rabbit_Reborn wrote on Feb 5th, 2017 at 5:40pm:
...that makes me a moron.
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glen65
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Re: Hurricane Mueller is closing in on the White House!
Reply #34 - Sep 11th, 2017 at 12:14pm
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Greg55_99 wrote on Sep 11th, 2017 at 10:29am:
Oh.... So you're acknowloging that Trump DID collude with the Russians.  You know that violates federal law don't you?

Greg


I acknowledged nothing. My point was what you showed me, does nothing to prove Clinton's loss was due to Trump and Russia colluding to tamper with the election.
If it did Mueller would already have the evidence he needed to effectively prove that case, and could wrap up his investigation.
  
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Greg55_99
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Re: Hurricane Mueller is closing in on the White House!
Reply #35 - Sep 11th, 2017 at 12:19pm
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glen65 wrote on Sep 11th, 2017 at 12:14pm:
I acknowledged nothing. My point was what you showed me, does nothing to prove Clinton's loss was due to Trump and Russia colluding to tamper with the election.
If it did Mueller would already have the evidence he needed to effectively prove that case, and could wrap up his investigation.   


Actually Attorney Chuckles, you did.  Now, the other thingie about proving her loss was due to the Russians is a different matter.  Anyway, the collusion with the Russians part...  proven.

Thank you for your time and attention.

Greg
  

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Re: Hurricane Mueller is closing in on the White House!
Reply #36 - Sep 11th, 2017 at 1:08pm
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Greg55_99 wrote on Sep 11th, 2017 at 12:19pm:
Actually Attorney Chuckles, you did. 


Actually no, and it wasn't necessary for me to anyway.
Acknowledgment of what you said wasn't and is not some sort of a prerequisite to what I pointed out earlier.

Quote:
Now, the other thingie about proving her loss was due to the Russians is a different matter.  Anyway, the collusion with the Russians part...  proven.

Thank you for your time and attention.

Greg



*Chuckle* No Greg, that's what this is about. The left ran it's mouth for months claiming the win was yanked from Clinton through Russia /Trump election tampering. That's the claim which ultimately resulted in Mueller's involvement to begin with.
  
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Re: Hurricane Mueller is closing in on the White House!
Reply #37 - Sep 11th, 2017 at 1:25pm
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glen65 wrote on Sep 11th, 2017 at 1:08pm:
Actually no, and it wasn't necessary for me to anyway.
Acknowledgment of what you said wasn't and is not some sort of a prerequisite to what I pointed out earlier.


*Chuckle* No Greg, that's what this is about. The left ran it's mouth for months claiming the win was yanked from Clinton through Russia /Trump election tampering. That's the claim which ultimately resulted in Mueller's involvement to begin with.


The jury's still out on whether Russian tampering in and of itself was behind Trump's victory.  There's more information coming in on this all the time.  There have been threads on this here on LNF -- things like actual evidence of Russian hacking into local and state election systems, the data warehouses of private-sector election contractors, etc.

But that is absolutely not the reason why Mueller started his investigation.  It is illegal to conspire with a foreign power to alter US elections, whether that conspiracy is successful or not.  If Trump were involved in this conspiracy, he'd be criminally liable.  If his TEAM was involved, THEY would be.  Any findings or eventual prosecution might be filtered through the lens of incompetency, but the investigation would still have full merit.

This is all obvious right on the face of it.  If Trump and friends are willing to do what is patently illegal in order to win, then it hardly matters that their shenanigans failed.  They can be counted on to do the wrong thing at all future decision points.  The legal and moral culpability is clear.
  

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Re: Hurricane Mueller is closing in on the White House!
Reply #38 - Sep 11th, 2017 at 1:49pm
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glen65 wrote on Sep 11th, 2017 at 12:14pm:
I acknowledged nothing. My point was what you showed me, does nothing to prove Clinton's loss was due to Trump and Russia colluding to tamper with the election.
If it did Mueller would already have the evidence he needed to effectively prove that case, and could wrap up his investigation.   

The investigation isn't about whether or not alleged collusion caused Hillary's loss. It's about whether there was collusion and any criminal acts, including obstruction of justice.
  
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Re: Hurricane Mueller is closing in on the White House!
Reply #39 - Sep 11th, 2017 at 1:51pm
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forgotten centrist wrote on Sep 11th, 2017 at 1:25pm:
The jury's still out on whether Russian tampering in and of itself was behind Trump's victory.  There's more information coming in on this all the time.  There have been threads on this here on LNF -- things like actual evidence of Russian hacking into local and state election systems, the data warehouses of private-sector election contractors, etc.


Which is due to lack of evidence.   

Quote:
But that is absolutely not the reason why Mueller started his investigation.  It is illegal to conspire with a foreign power to alter US elections, whether that conspiracy is successful or not.  If Trump were involved in this conspiracy, he'd be criminally liable.  If his TEAM was involved, THEY would be.  Any findings or eventual prosecution might be filtered through the lens of incompetency, but the investigation would still have full merit.

This is all obvious right on the face of it.  If Trump and friends are willing to do what is patently illegal in order to win, then it hardly matters that their shenanigans failed.  They can be counted on to do the wrong thing at all future decision points.  The legal and moral culpability is clear.


So the claim Clinton's loss was due to Trump working with Russia to tamper with the election, doesn't fall under the law you're talking about here?
  
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