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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Sins of Our Fathers (Read 1,932 times)
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Re: Sins of Our Fathers
Reply #10 - Sep 29th, 2017 at 12:51pm
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petep wrote on Sep 29th, 2017 at 12:15pm:
Why is it so hard for some to accept that many do not like obama because was was an incompetent divisive man.



Because people don't value the opinions of uninformed far-right fools.  Sorry for being redundant.

  

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Queshank
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Re: Sins of Our Fathers
Reply #11 - Sep 29th, 2017 at 12:52pm
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Nazi Hunter B.S.C. wrote on Sep 28th, 2017 at 11:34pm:
Just hear me out, bare with me, this might be my longest OP I've ever posted.  I'll not make it a habit.   Undecided

So there we were, just elected the first African American president. Many of us appreciated and most at least tolerated his deliberate and eloquent demeanor.  Damn we were cool, so post-racial, so cosmopolitan, so hip...    Cool

*record scratching sound*

The very next god damn president we elect is the exact opposite.  Learning as he goes, not a particularly good speaker, can't seem to negotiate his way out of a wet paper bag and that's with his OWN party!  He had to switch sides to get anything through or so it seems.

https://illinois.uloop.com/news/view.php/247524/Unmasking-the-Ugly-Truth-Why-Don...

Meanwhile, suddenly white supremacists are emboldened enough to march with tiki torches down main street, giving each other the Nazi salute all while wearing MAGA hats.

How is this possible? We’ve gone from viewing ourselves as post-racial, to having white nationalists proudly chanting hateful epithets and giving Nazi salutes on a college campus.

Lincoln said, “America will never be destroyed from the outside. If we falter and lose our freedoms, it will be because we destroyed ourselves.”

At the time that Lincoln made that statement, America was at war with itself over basic human rights. We have the most convoluted origin stories in the modern Western world. We are a nation full of contradictions.

Founded on the principles of freedom and equality, in reality, we only value freedom for S.W.A.S.P.s (Straight White Anglo-Saxon Protestants), and equality doesn’t really exist as the U.S. has high levels of social stratification that date back to the 1600s. The Revolutionary War exemplifies this: patriots fighting for freedom while owning slaves.

In sociology, this is referred to as ideal culture vs. real culture. 

https://www.quora.com/What-is-the-difference-between-real-and-ideal-culture

We love to point to the Germans and speak of their horrible treatment of the Jews. But we did the same damn thing in our quest to become a powerful nation.   We come off as the orcs of Mordor and not the hobbits of the Shire.

To achieve Manifest Destiny, we had to wipe out a few people first.  We started with biochemical warfare in the form of smallpox-laced blankets. After killing off the Red Man, we psychologically destroyed the Black Man using Willie Lynch’s slave manual and then forced him to work on the stolen land.

On a personal note, my best friend in grade school through junior high was an African American boy named Kenan.  It never occurred to me why my friend and his parents referred to his little brother as "little man."  Well, I just learned that this is done in response to some white people routinely calling black men boys and disrespecting their manhood.  This also contributes, I believe, to rap being so overly charged with testosterone.  They are constantly feeling like they need to prove their manhood. 

*Takes a knee as his nations simplistic and stupid sounding anthem starts waltzing through the forum*


You're spot on with the "we're so cool, post racial" etc attitude the left, the media and Hollywood had.  But I think the rest of what you're writing is doubling down on how blind to their own arrogance people became during the same timeframe.

This topic is something Sam Harris discusses with Mark Lilla in his most recent "Waking up with Sam Harris" podcast called "What Happened to Liberalism?" from yesterday.  I highly recommend you give a listen because they discuss a lot of what you're touching on, plus some of what I've observed as being a split between liberalism and the left. 

It's interesting listening to Harris's podcast over time because he is so anti Trump he is almost irrational.  And he is a very rational, intelligent and logical guy.  Over the past year you can kind of see him starting to wake up to some things that he overlooked.  Or as I like to look at it .. the TDS fever is starting to break for Sam Harris.

Mark Lilla wrote a book "The Once and Future Liberal: After Identity Politics" They discuss it in this podcast and discuss how liberalism gave way to identity politics, and the reaction this has had.  I'd never heard of Mark Lilla but I'm looking into him now. I might have to pick up his book.

I think the backlash against how irrational and controlling identity politics has become is the most important story both of the 2016 election and of the phenomenon that is going on right now in countries throughout the West.

Queshank
  

Morality is doing what is right, regardless of what you are told.

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Nazi Hunter B.S.C.
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Re: Sins of Our Fathers
Reply #12 - Sep 29th, 2017 at 3:24pm
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Harry and company wrote on Sep 29th, 2017 at 1:59am:
The worst President in history, the one who could have made race a thing of the past, instead raised racial strife to new levels of incendiary.

I get it. You want strife, war in the streets, and death.

Just as your President does.


And I thought Iwas naive!  lol

Were you hoping Barak was going to get up on stage and say, "there, we're post racial totally, you're all forgiven."

He made strides BY calling attention to the racism still simmering below the surface. 
« Last Edit: Sep 29th, 2017 at 3:55pm by Nazi Hunter B.S.C. »  

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Re: Sins of Our Fathers
Reply #13 - Sep 29th, 2017 at 3:25pm
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patrick2 wrote on Sep 29th, 2017 at 12:40pm:
Even more utter detachment from reality from the robot left wing - Hussein was CERTAINLY one of the worst presidents in US history - probably would have the worst nailed down if it weren't for Jimmy Carter.  Grin


BS.  But then again, your a one of them people that did or would have voted for Reagan, the real worst president in our history.
  

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Nazi Hunter B.S.C.
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Re: Sins of Our Fathers
Reply #14 - Sep 29th, 2017 at 3:53pm
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Queshank wrote on Sep 29th, 2017 at 12:52pm:
You're spot on with the "we're so cool, post racial" etc attitude the left, the media and Hollywood had.  But I think the rest of what you're writing is doubling down on how blind to their own arrogance people became during the same timeframe.

This topic is something Sam Harris discusses with Mark Lilla in his most recent "Waking up with Sam Harris" podcast called "What Happened to Liberalism?" from yesterday.  I highly recommend you give a listen because they discuss a lot of what you're touching on, plus some of what I've observed as being a split between liberalism and the left. 

It's interesting listening to Harris's podcast over time because he is so anti Trump he is almost irrational.  And he is a very rational, intelligent and logical guy.  Over the past year you can kind of see him starting to wake up to some things that he overlooked.  Or as I like to look at it .. the TDS fever is starting to break for Sam Harris.

Mark Lilla wrote a book "The Once and Future Liberal: After Identity Politics" They discuss it in this podcast and discuss how liberalism gave way to identity politics, and the reaction this has had.  I'd never heard of Mark Lilla but I'm looking into him now. I might have to pick up his book.

I think the backlash against how irrational and controlling identity politics has become is the most important story both of the 2016 election and of the phenomenon that is going on right now in countries throughout the West.

Queshank


I will give it a listen this evening when I get home from work, but my initial knee jerks reaction when I hear people complain about identity politics, is "keep crying white people!"

The most destructive, some might even say evil, identity politics of our day, is the concept of "the white man." Oh look!  Most of Trumps supporters are non-college educated white men, many first time voters. 

Sure, you could say Obama paved the way for this backlash, but that doesn't make the backlash good or noble.  it's not just coincidence that white supremacists from all walks of life have been energized.  They're ready for the final solution and Trump is just the beginning.

I sincerely wonder if Trump really does think that some white nationalists/supremacists are "really fine people," or if he's orchestrating these verbal gaffs to remain popular among his core supporters, that basket of deplorables he likes to carry around.

I've decided I can never support Trump, even if he miraculously gets some left DNC sponsored bills through, it won't be enough for me. He speaks for us on an international stage and while the presidency is certainly no moral compass, he needs to at least carry the water of decent thoughts and ideas. 

I welcome antifa, I embrace them with open arms.  Notice you didn't see a damn thing in the news about Antifa until neo Nazi's decided they could march down main street USA?  Sorry Nazi's, we're going to kick your ass if we see you trying to march and getting all uppity again.  It is not a valid political position worthy of discourse, they need to be swatted like the insects that they are.


  

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Re: Sins of Our Fathers
Reply #15 - Sep 29th, 2017 at 4:10pm
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Nazi Hunter B.S.C. wrote on Sep 29th, 2017 at 3:24pm:
And I thought Iwas naive!  lol

Were you hoping Barak was going to get up on stage and say, "there, we're post racial totally, you're all forgiven."

He made strides BY calling attention to the racism still simmering below the surface. 


DING  DING  DING

we have a winner folks!
  
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Re: Sins of Our Fathers
Reply #16 - Sep 29th, 2017 at 4:26pm
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USyeah wrote on Sep 29th, 2017 at 4:10pm:
DING  DING  DING

we have a winner folks!


Thanks man!

I PM'ed you my paypal account should there be any monetary awards forthcoming. 

Smiley
  

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Re: Sins of Our Fathers
Reply #17 - Sep 29th, 2017 at 5:29pm
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Nazi Hunter B.S.C. wrote on Sep 29th, 2017 at 3:53pm:
I will give it a listen this evening when I get home from work, but my initial knee jerks reaction when I hear people complain about identity politics, is "keep crying white people!"

The most destructive, some might even say evil, identity politics of our day, is the concept of "the white man." Oh look!  Most of Trumps supporters are non-college educated white men, many first time voters. 

Sure, you could say Obama paved the way for this backlash, but that doesn't make the backlash good or noble.  it's not just coincidence that white supremacists from all walks of life have been energized.  They're ready for the final solution and Trump is just the beginning.


No.  The Clinton presidency in the 90s did.

Quote:
I sincerely wonder if Trump really does think that some white nationalists/supremacists are "really fine people," or if he's orchestrating these verbal gaffs to remain popular among his core supporters, that basket of deplorables he likes to carry around.


No he's pointing to a weakness on the left.

The tendency among leftists in America to think everyone who doesn't agree with them is either a racist or an alt rightist (and ergo...a racist.)

It's only a matter of time before it gets pushed too far.  Trump was just laying a confirmation bias trap.  A pretty obvious one no less.

Are you familiar with Felix Kjellberg?  Better known as Pewdiepie?  He's the #1 youtuber in the world.  Over 57 million subscribers.  The next closest youtuber has 31 million.  For the past year he's dealing with charges of racism, white supremacy and being an alt right member.  From the Wall Street Journal and Wired magazine and other such.  JK Rowling even lashed out at him.  It's been fascinating watching people turn on him.  He had 3 million fewer subscribers before he got in trouble and lost his deal with Disney and Youtube Red.  Doesn't seem to be slowing down his channel growth.

How about Colin Moriarty?  He was a co founder of the Kinda Funny website.  He was also the editor for IGN for quite awhile.  He made a twitter joke ... "Ah, peace and quiet.   #ADayWithoutAWoman."  Only one of the oldest jokes of all time.  He was booted from Kinda Funny and is castigated as an alt rightist.

How about the guy who got fired from Google ... engineer James Damore?  If you actually read what he wrote ... he pointed out that forcing women to work and behave like men doesn't work out.  That companies like his own (google) need to actually retailor the way they do things to attract women.  Only 20% of Google's workforce is women.  WTF!?!  Google!??!  Liberal bastion?!

Quote:
I've decided I can never support Trump, even if he miraculously gets some left DNC sponsored bills through, it won't be enough for me. He speaks for us on an international stage and while the presidency is certainly no moral compass, he needs to at least carry the water of decent thoughts and ideas. 


Can you be specific about what he's said on the world stage that you disagree with?

Quote:
I welcome antifa, I embrace them with open arms.  Notice you didn't see a damn thing in the news about Antifa until neo Nazi's decided they could march down main street USA?  Sorry Nazi's, we're going to kick your ass if we see you trying to march and getting all uppity again.  It is not a valid political position worthy of discourse, they need to be swatted like the insects that they are.


No we were seeing Antifa in the news during the campaign too.  They were beating up Trump supporters in the streets.  I remember an atheist group I was in during the campaign where they were saying they needed to use violence against Trump supporters because "they won't listen." 

You just weren't paying enough attention.

It was one of the reasons I decided I can't be a member of the left anymore.

You're virtue signalling to back a losing horse.

When you could be agitating for a winning horse ... actual liberal ideas.  Not violently censoring people you disagree with.

Queshank
  

Morality is doing what is right, regardless of what you are told.

Religion is doing what you are told, regardless of what is right.
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Re: Sins of Our Fathers
Reply #18 - Sep 29th, 2017 at 5:42pm
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Nazi Hunter B.S.C. wrote on Sep 29th, 2017 at 3:53pm:
I will give it a listen this evening when I get home from work, but my initial knee jerks reaction when I hear people complain about identity politics, is "keep crying white people!"

The most destructive, some might even say evil, identity politics of our day, is the concept of "the white man." Oh look!  Most of Trumps supporters are non-college educated white men, many first time voters. 

Sure, you could say Obama paved the way for this backlash, but that doesn't make the backlash good or noble.  it's not just coincidence that white supremacists from all walks of life have been energized.  They're ready for the final solution and Trump is just the beginning.






I sincerely wonder if Trump really does think that some white nationalists/supremacists are "really fine people," or if he's orchestrating these verbal gaffs to remain popular among his core supporters, that basket of deplorables he likes to carry around.

I've decided I can never support Trump, even if he miraculously gets some left DNC sponsored bills through, it won't be enough for me. He speaks for us on an international stage and while the presidency is certainly no moral compass, he needs to at least carry the water of decent thoughts and ideas. 

I welcome antifa, I embrace them with open arms.  Notice you didn't see a damn thing in the news about Antifa until neo Nazi's decided they could march down main street USA?  Sorry Nazi's, we're going to kick your ass if we see you trying to march and getting all uppity again.  It is not a valid political position worthy of discourse, they need to be swatted like the insects that they are.




I'll give you a certain amount of "credit" -  you're the first anti-white racist to forth-rightly admit it.  Wink
  
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Re: Sins of Our Fathers
Reply #19 - Sep 30th, 2017 at 3:16am
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patrick2 wrote on Sep 29th, 2017 at 5:42pm:
I'll give you a certain amount of "credit" -  you're the first anti-white racist to forth-rightly admit it.  Wink


Have you been to a KKK rally as participant ever? If so, did you have fun there and maybe pick up any chicks?  Are you, currently, a card carrying neo-nazi?  I'll be generous and assume not.  I'll also kindly disagree and grant you that you are not a "white man."

I bet no one on LNF is actually a white man, something you choose to be, not something you are born with.

I should start a "Pray the white away" Jesus camp.  I really should!  Hmmmm.
  

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