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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Israel Celebrates. (Read 2,418 times)
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Re: Israel Celebrates.
Reply #90 - Jan 31st, 2018 at 3:58pm
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Limey. wrote on Jan 31st, 2018 at 2:54pm:
Like we evil British do.  Grin



Muslim, Christian, Taoist??   Do you guys pray for or against it.. ?
  

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Limey.
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Re: Israel Celebrates.
Reply #91 - Jan 31st, 2018 at 7:05pm
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Fiddler wrote on Jan 31st, 2018 at 3:58pm:
Muslim, Christian, Taoist??   Do you guys pray for or against it.. ?



http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-35161361
  

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Re: Israel Celebrates.
Reply #92 - Jan 31st, 2018 at 7:54pm
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Seawolf wrote on Jan 30th, 2018 at 10:37pm:
The point I am trying to make is that neither states or the feds have any authority to violate ones right to freely express their faith publicly.  You can not force someone of faith to violate their faith within reason, meaning that if their faith deprives someone else freedom then that would be an exception.


Agreed.

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I bring up schools because the Dept of Education was created and overstepped it's role by turning public schools into government controlled property due to it's funding, something that the Constitution gives the feds no authority to do.


Public schools have always been government-owned property.  They're owned by boards of education established by the various states and always have been.  Establishing the Department of Education in 1979 didn't change that at all.

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It is no coincidence that prayers are now banned after it's creation.


The Department of Education doesn't ban school-run prayer.  The Constitution, as interpreted by the Supreme Court, does.

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Schools were meant to be controlled by the community with no government interference.


The "community" is just another branch of government.

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I can cite an example of Congress allowing their facility to be used as a church on the weekends, the founders did not view this as a violation of the Constitution they wrote.


Correct, it doesn't.  Many schools allow religious groups to rent space on the weekends and hold meetings, too.  That's different from a taxpayer-paid teacher leading public schoolchildren in the prayers of a particular faith.

I know this is a terrible shock to everyone, but you really don't understand what's going on at all.
  

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Re: Israel Celebrates.
Reply #93 - Jan 31st, 2018 at 9:50pm
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Running Deer wrote on Jan 31st, 2018 at 7:54pm:
Agreed.


Public schools have always been government-owned property.  They're owned by boards of education established by the various states and always have been.  Establishing the Department of Education in 1979 didn't change that at all.


The Department of Education doesn't ban school-run prayer.  The Constitution, as interpreted by the Supreme Court, does.


The "community" is just another branch of government.


Correct, it doesn't.  Many schools allow religious groups to rent space on the weekends and hold meetings, too.  That's different from a taxpayer-paid teacher leading public schoolchildren in the prayers of a particular faith.

I know this is a terrible shock to everyone, but you really don't understand what's going on at all.

Because we do not agree should not come as a shock.  I will say this again because you skirted my point.  Schools were always meant to be run locally, not federally.  The Dept of Education allowed the Federal Government the ability to inject itself by distributing federal dollars to schools with stipulations.  As I stated, and you did not disagree, the federal government has not constitutional mandate regarding schools.  By funding schools they have taken control of what was meant to be run locally with parental influence, thus they have effectively taken prayer out of schools.  You can disagree but prayers have been in schools since the very beginning till the 80s.  Bibles were taught in schools early on and neither were viewed by the founders as violating their intent.  A lot of history is being intentionally distorted, excellent example is the Danbury Church letter to Jefferson that is often grossly mischaracterized.
  


"Without morals a republic cannot subsist any length of time; they therefore who are decrying the Christian religion, whose morality is so sublime and pure (and) which insures to the good eternal happiness, are undermining the solid foundation of morals, the best security for the duration of free governments."

Charles Carroll, signer of the DOI
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Re: Israel Celebrates.
Reply #94 - Jan 31st, 2018 at 9:57pm
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Take note RR, I see no need to insult you.  It tends to reflect a sense of insecurity when one has to dig at the other.  I am old enough now to understand people will tend to disagree.  That is life, I could care less what you think of me as it has no significance to me one way or the other.  I enjoy discussions but I just never can understand the need to wallow in the mud as it is more about self-gratification.
  


"Without morals a republic cannot subsist any length of time; they therefore who are decrying the Christian religion, whose morality is so sublime and pure (and) which insures to the good eternal happiness, are undermining the solid foundation of morals, the best security for the duration of free governments."

Charles Carroll, signer of the DOI
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