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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Trump denies knowledge of Manafort Conspiracy with Russian Intelligence (Read 786 times)
Greg55_99
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Re: Trump denies knowledge of Manafort Conspiracy with Russian Intelligence
Reply #50 - Jan 10th, 2019 at 1:06pm
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Vypr wrote on Jan 10th, 2019 at 1:05pm:
Manafort can connect everyone, that's why he will get a pardon.


I actually don't think he will.

Greg
  

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Re: Trump denies knowledge of Manafort Conspiracy with Russian Intelligence
Reply #51 - Jan 10th, 2019 at 1:19pm
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Greg55_99 wrote on Jan 10th, 2019 at 1:06pm:
I actually don't think he will.

Greg

It depends on how much comes out or is already known. If all of the secrets he's holding end up coming out anyway, he might find "don't give a shit about anyone but myself" Trump says f**k it and lets him burn.
  

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Rabbit_Reborn
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Re: Trump denies knowledge of Manafort Conspiracy with Russian Intelligence
Reply #52 - Jan 10th, 2019 at 2:26pm
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Greg55_99 wrote on Jan 10th, 2019 at 12:18pm:

Sorry. Yes. That was a mistake by omission, though it went through my mind. Conspiracy must require an actual crime, or the planning of an actual crime.

However, conviction of conspiracy to perform a pre-meditated crime that does not end up being committed requires serious evidence. Like writings and tapes and pictures of people very clearly showing the crime being planned and discussed.

Not speculation. Not circumstantial evidence.
  

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Rabbit_Reborn
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Re: Trump denies knowledge of Manafort Conspiracy with Russian Intelligence
Reply #53 - Jan 10th, 2019 at 2:27pm
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forgotten centrist wrote on Jan 10th, 2019 at 12:19pm:
Not true.  There is a steady trickle of cases where the FBI arrests people conspiring to commit terrorist acts.  No acts have been committed yet, but conspiring to commit the acts is itself a crime.

Yes. My fault. But to convict of conspiracy without an actual committing of a crime, the standard of evidence that the crime is being planned is high.

As well it should be.

It can't be speculative or circumstantial.
  

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Freon_Bale
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Re: Trump denies knowledge of Manafort Conspiracy with Russian Intelligence
Reply #54 - Jan 10th, 2019 at 2:30pm
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You see, for once, I agree with Trump.

He admits he knows nothing. That is the first truthful thing I've ever heard him say.
  
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Rabbit_Reborn
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Re: Trump denies knowledge of Manafort Conspiracy with Russian Intelligence
Reply #55 - Jan 10th, 2019 at 2:33pm
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Freon_Bale wrote on Jan 10th, 2019 at 2:30pm:
You see, for once, I agree with Trump.

He admits he knows nothing. That is the first truthful thing I've ever heard him say.

Why do you think it's taking years to find evidence of him illegally working with Russia to impact democratic elections? Since he knows nothing?
  

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Greg55_99
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Re: Trump denies knowledge of Manafort Conspiracy with Russian Intelligence
Reply #56 - Jan 10th, 2019 at 2:38pm
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Rabbit_Reborn wrote on Jan 10th, 2019 at 2:26pm:
Sorry. Yes. That was a mistake by omission, though it went through my mind. Conspiracy must require an actual crime, or the planning of an actual crime.

However, conviction of conspiracy to perform a pre-meditated crime that does not end up being committed requires serious evidence. Like writings and tapes and pictures of people very clearly showing the crime being planned and discussed.

Not speculation. Not circumstantial evidence.


Right.  Like...  The Campaign Manager for a presidential candidate going to Madrid Spain, passing campaign data to a Russian foreign national (trained as a GRU operative) and asking HIM to pass the information on to two other foreign nationals (pro-Russian Ukranians).

I think a case could be made for conspiracy.  Actually, I think it has already.

Greg


  

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Rabbit_Reborn
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Re: Trump denies knowledge of Manafort Conspiracy with Russian Intelligence
Reply #57 - Jan 10th, 2019 at 2:44pm
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Greg55_99 wrote on Jan 10th, 2019 at 2:38pm:
Right.  Like...  The Campaign Manager for a presidential candidate going to Madrid Spain, passing campaign data to a Russian foreign national (trained as a GRU operative) and asking HIM to pass the information on to two other foreign nationals (pro-Russian Ukranians).

I think a case could be made for conspiracy.  Actually, I think it has already.

Greg



A case against Trump?

What was the crime they were conspiring to commit?

And what evidence exists that this crime was planning on being committed with the support or knowledge of Trump?
  

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Greg55_99
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Re: Trump denies knowledge of Manafort Conspiracy with Russian Intelligence
Reply #58 - Jan 10th, 2019 at 3:27pm
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Rabbit_Reborn wrote on Jan 10th, 2019 at 2:44pm:
A case against Trump?



Right now, the case involves Manafort.  That is what we are discussing.


Quote:
What was the crime they were conspiring to commit? 


Conspiracy to defraud the people of the United States.  12 Russians have already been thus charged by Mueller.

Quote:
And what evidence exists that this crime was planning on being committed with the support or knowledge of Trump?


IF it exists, it has not yet been made public.  The only reason we know about Manafort is because of a foul up by his lawyers.

Greg
  

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Freon_Bale
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Re: Trump denies knowledge of Manafort Conspiracy with Russian Intelligence
Reply #59 - Jan 10th, 2019 at 3:36pm
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Rabbit_Reborn wrote on Jan 10th, 2019 at 2:33pm:
Why do you think it's taking years to find evidence of him illegally working with Russia to impact democratic elections? Since he knows nothing?


Whoa, there, sparky. Let's see what Mueller has to say before we assume he has nothing.

You are awful quick to point to nothing-burgers with limited, to no, information. Oh, just like Trump. Nevermind.
  
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