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Liberty News ForumLNF Forums HerePolitical Opinion Page - The Hot Seat › Senate Votes to Remove US Military from Yemeni Conflict
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Hot Topic (More than 10 Replies) Senate Votes to Remove US Military from Yemeni Conflict (Read 481 times)
Demos
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Senate Votes to Remove US Military from Yemeni Conflict
Mar 14th, 2019 at 11:07am
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Senate rebuffs Trump with vote cutting off U.S. support in Yemen

The Senate on Wednesday gave President Donald Trump’s foreign policy yet another vote of no-confidence, approving a resolution to cut off U.S. support for the Saudi-led coalition in Yemen’s bloody civil war.

Seven Republicans joined all members of the Democratic Caucus in backing the bill, which senators viewed as an opportunity not only toreassert Congress’ authority to declare war, but to rebuke the Trump administration over its posture toward Saudi Arabia in the aftermath of the murder of journalist Jamal Khashoggi...

The House passed a similar measure last month, but it was blocked from getting a vote in the Senate after the parliamentarian ruled that one of the amendments — a Republican-led effort to condemn anti-Semitism — was not “germane” to the legislation, effectively killing it.

House Democratic leaders intend to hold a vote on the Senate-passed version, setting up a presidential veto...

Source

The Senate bill is SR 7 and it would require the President to remove U.S. troops within 30 days (of enactment of the law).

The vote can be viewed here: Roll Call #48.

As mentioned, the House passed a similar measure, and there is a thread about that here:

House Votes to Halt Aid for Saudi's Yemeni War
  
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Re: Senate Votes to Remove US Military from Yemeni Conflict
Reply #1 - Mar 14th, 2019 at 11:18am
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This is a win for al-Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula.

At least some will feel better about punishing the Saudi Crown Prince (even if it kills us)

Vladimir Putin will probably take up the slack and partner with the Saudi's.  Fools rush out where Angels fear to stay.  Where the Saudi's go; so goes OPEC.  Russia and China will be the winners and the US and our allies will be the losers.  At least some will "feel" like they did the morally correct thing.

Perry warns Saudi will partner with "Russia or China" on nuclear reactors if U.S. can't strike deal
https://www.chron.com/business/energy/article/Perry-warns-Saudi-will-partner-wit...
As Saudi-US relations hit rock bottom, could Saudi turn to Russia or China?
https://www.trtworld.com/opinion/as-saudi-us-relations-hit-rock-bottom-could-sau...

« Last Edit: Mar 14th, 2019 at 11:26am by Wally Wants A Wall »  

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Re: Senate Votes to Remove US Military from Yemeni Conflict
Reply #2 - Mar 14th, 2019 at 11:24am
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Wally Wants A Wall wrote on Mar 14th, 2019 at 11:18am:
This is a win for al-Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula.

It's a win for the rule of law, since there was no Congressional authorization for it. If the President, you or anyone else thinks we need troops there, then get the authorization.
  
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Re: Senate Votes to Remove US Military from Yemeni Conflict
Reply #3 - Mar 14th, 2019 at 11:30am
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Demos wrote on Mar 14th, 2019 at 11:24am:
It's a win for the rule of law, since there was no Congressional authorization for it. If the President, you or anyone else thinks we need troops there, then get the authorization.

Perhaps the proper course would have been for Congress to authorize it specifically, since our fight in Yeman is against Al Qaeda and is under the 17 year old authority they gave the Executive to combat Al Qaeda.

Has Saudi Arabia just pivoted towards Russia?
https://blogs.spectator.co.uk/2018/12/has-saudi-arabia-just-pivoted-towards-russ...
  

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Re: Senate Votes to Remove US Military from Yemeni Conflict
Reply #4 - Mar 14th, 2019 at 11:40am
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Wally Wants A Wall wrote on Mar 14th, 2019 at 11:30am:
Perhaps the proper course would have been for Congress to authorize it specifically,...

They haven't authorized it though which is the issue. 

Quote:
...since our fight in Yeman is against Al Qaeda and is under the 17 year old authority they gave the Executive to combat Al Qaeda.

We're involved in a civil war right now, backing the Saudi side, which goes well beyond AQAP.

Quote:
Has Saudi Arabia just pivoted towards Russia?

The Saudis are seeking aid and assistance from Russia, China, etc. And frankly, if any of those countries want that headache, let them have it. We should be developing alternatives to ME oil to reduce our dependence, play the role of off-shore balancer, and be a more honest broker in the region.
  
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Re: Senate Votes to Remove US Military from Yemeni Conflict
Reply #5 - Mar 14th, 2019 at 11:56am
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Demos wrote on Mar 14th, 2019 at 11:40am:
They haven't authorized it though which is the issue. 

We're involved in a civil war right now, backing the Saudi side, which goes well beyond AQAP.

The Saudis are seeking aid and assistance from Russia, China, etc. And frankly, if any of those countries want that headache, let them have it. We should be developing alternatives to ME oil to reduce our dependence, play the role of off-shore balancer, and be a more honest broker in the region.

There are several issues you address which have merit on each side and are worthy of debate. 

The AUMF arguably does far more apply to the fight against Al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula than it did to our invasion of Iraq or our presence in Syria.  As far as Syria goes, it is the same Congress which demands we get out of the fight in Yeman that disagreed with Trump wanting to leave Syria.  Where's the specific authorization from Congress for us to have troops in Syria?  Isn't our military use of force in Syria under this same AUMF?  The civil war in Yeman is fostered by Al Qaeda just as the tribal conflicts were exploited by the Taliban and Al Qaeda in Afghanistan.

We have been able to keep a leash on Saudi Arabia and those they influence, although obviously we can not control them.  Our relationship with the Saudi''s is like our relationship with Stalin when he was committing mass extermination of his own citizens.  Stalin was not our friend but our alliance was necessary and a lot had to be overlooked and accepted, for the sake of our alliance.  (Hell, Hitler and Stalin had a non aggression pact for much of the war, until Hitler broke their alliance and Stalin joined our alliance).

We are not the only nation who use and are dependent on fossil fuels.  As a matter of fact, the US is a net exporter of fossil fuels.  Our allies needs middle eastern fossil fuels to survive.  If Russia (with or without China) gains control of the Middle East's oil, along with Russia's pipelines to Europe, Vladimir Putin can dictate terms to all of our European allies.

The Balance of Power is something that seems to be missing now days from any of the debates.  It's not that we need the oil; it's that the rest of the world does and we need the rest of the world (as much of them as we can) to be on our side.



  

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Re: Senate Votes to Remove US Military from Yemeni Conflict
Reply #6 - Mar 14th, 2019 at 12:26pm
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Wally Wants A Wall wrote on Mar 14th, 2019 at 11:56am:
The AUMF arguably does far more apply to the fight against Al Qaeda in the Arabian Peninsula than it did to our invasion of Iraq or our presence in Syria.

I wouldn't fundamentally disagree; however, what we're doing in Yemen is no longer just about AQAP. We're engaged - with the Saudis - against the Houthis in Yemen's civil war. The resolution clearly lays that out, and there is no Congressional authorization to be fighting the Houthis.

Quote:
As far as Syria goes, it is the same Congress which demands we get out of the fight in Yeman that disagreed with Trump wanting to leave Syria.  Where's the specific authorization from Congress for us to have troops in Syria?

There isn't one. Legally and constitutionally, we shouldn't be there. 

Quote:
Isn't our military use of force in Syria under this same AUMF?

That's part of the justification, but the AUMF doesn't cover ISIS, and it definitely doesn't cover whatever supposed mission we're remaining there for. 

Quote:
The civil war in Yeman is fostered by Al Qaeda...

No it's not.

The civil war was fostered by former President Saleh, who was forced to hand over power during the Arab Spring. He was replaced by Hadi. In 2014 Saleh allied himself with the Houthis, and together with some Sunni factions, attacked Hadi's government. The Saudis are fighting on behalf of Hadi's government, which is now in exile in Saudi Arabia. 

You might argue AQAP is taking advantage of the chaos, but they didn't "foster" the civil war.

Quote:
We have been able to keep a leash on Saudi Arabia and those they influence, although obviously we can not control them.
 
Have we?

Quote:
Our relationship with the Saudi''s is like our relationship with Stalin when he was committing mass extermination of his own citizens.

Our relationship with the Saudis is primarily about oil and always has been. Recently, it's also been about some counterterrorism efforts, but oil is what drives this relationship.

Quote:
We are not the only nation who use and are dependent on fossil fuels.

We're not, but our dependence on it is what has forced us into these situations vis a vis the Saudis and other Arab states. Divesting the country of that dependence allows us greater freedom of action. 

Quote:
Our allies needs middle eastern fossil fuels to survive.  If Russia (with or without China) gains control of the Middle East's oil, along with Russia's pipelines to Europe, Vladimir Putin can dictate terms to all of our European allies.

And that's where offshore balancing comes into play.
  
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Re: Senate Votes to Remove US Military from Yemeni Conflict
Reply #7 - Mar 14th, 2019 at 12:30pm
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I am for this bill.  We need to be very selective bout sending our troops into a conflict.  We need a clear strategy and a definition of what success is before we commit our blood and resources into a region.  I fear we are stretching our resources thin.
  


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Re: Senate Votes to Remove US Military from Yemeni Conflict
Reply #8 - Mar 14th, 2019 at 7:31pm
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I approve.

Declare war or do not go.

I don't even like the weak-as-milk "authorization," but at least it's better than the POTUS just sending troops wherever.

But the best way would be to declare war. If you're going to commit acts of war against a nation, then declare war against them first.

If you can't even stomach that, then maybe you shouldn't be in Congress. War is serious business for serious people and the power to declare war is an expressed power reserved for Congress. Use it or don't, but don't weasel around it.
  

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Re: Senate Votes to Remove US Military from Yemeni Conflict
Reply #9 - Mar 14th, 2019 at 7:41pm
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Excellent. I hope Trump signs it.
  




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