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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) 'We will HIT you in the HEAD!' (Read 1,169 times)
Limey.
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Re: 'We will HIT you in the HEAD!'
Reply #70 - May 15th, 2019 at 3:42pm
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petep wrote on May 15th, 2019 at 2:48pm:
which shah are you talking about? and which year did teh son take over...and what year did carter stop selling him weapons...

how many years were things not a problem?


It's the fact of US/British meddling that is the problem.

A propaganda gift, based on real memories of real people,  many still alive.


Denying or obscuring it is a mistake.
  

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petep
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Re: 'We will HIT you in the HEAD!'
Reply #71 - May 15th, 2019 at 4:24pm
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Limey. wrote on May 15th, 2019 at 3:42pm:
It's the fact of US/British meddling that is the problem.

A propaganda gift, based on real memories of real people,  many still alive.


Denying or obscuring it is a mistake.


I'm not disputing countries influencing/meddling...I'd argue that in almost every election or position of power in almost every country there is influencing, positioning, etc...the spectrum is nothing to outright military assistance to overthrow...heck, the US under obama openly gave huge sums of money for one israeli candidate over another...was that bad meddling or was it OK because, well you know, it was obama doing it?

countries have interests...they all do...they act in their interests...presumably on behalf of their own populace...

one could say we militarily intervened to overthrow hitler...was that bad? Were the german people never going to forgive us for meddling? should they be blowing up UK and US cafe's today because we meddled? when is meddling good and when is it bad?

or was the meddling good at the time and years later came back to bite you (ie. us support of afghans against the ussr)...many said well osama b is the US's fault...maybe...should we have let the USSR take over all of afghanis...

I'm simply arguing to blame what iran has been doing for some time on us/britain meddling decades ago is very narrow minded...its often a very left knee jerk reaction to rationalize bad behavior...

if jews were blowing up german cafes today, or southerners blowing up boston cafes, or japanese blowing themselves up screaming hiroshima payback we could all rationalize that right? would we understand if the germans were getting blown up every weekend at cafes because they wiped out half of all jews on earth in brutal fashion...no we wouldn't....because these things don't happen do they....and we don't have to rationalize it do we?

but we are expected to rationalize outrageously crazy iranian behavior today because decades and decades ago the us/britain lended support to ousting a father who many iranians did not want anyway and we thought we'd have a much better ally in the ridiculously turbulent and violent and anti west middle east...and for decades he did turn out to be good for iran and a good ally...until he went too far...

yes, you can rationalize bad behavior....but rationalizing behavior is a fools errand because then everyone has an excuse for bad behavior don't they? Most all the the west moves on pretty darn fast after conflict..

Limey, you of all people know the absolute brutal brutal tactics of the english for centuries against the irish, scottish etc...yet you are the first to denounce the behavior and actions of the IRA that took place over a few decades...if you are being honest and consistent and using the same paradigm as you are with iran, then you'd be saying I guess its englands fault, you reap what you sow and we deserve it...but you don't "use your rear view mirror" as you put it when it comes to your position here...

  
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Limey.
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Re: 'We will HIT you in the HEAD!'
Reply #72 - May 15th, 2019 at 5:14pm
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You entirely misunderstand.


The actions of the Iranian state, like those of Irish criminal terrorists,  are wicked and beyond any forgiveness.


The reasons for these actions are complex,  and include the representation,  and misrepresentation,  of historical events.

Don't get me started on the bollocks the Irish Republican wankers spout.... we'll be here weeks.


However,  the kernels of truth are there.

In our, British,  case, there's never been any denial,  at least not for a couple of centuries,  that brutality was an element in English control of Ireland.

It's far, far more complicated than that.  But the honesty is there, the stark facts of Cromwell's methods aren't denied.


I'm bringing up, on this thread,  the disconnect between American public understanding of recent relevant history and Iranian public understanding of recent relevant history.


You'll note that I'm not ascribing blame, justice,  right,  wrong; simply pointing out that overthrow of elected leaders, not long after violent invasions, can rile people up.
  

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Re: 'We will HIT you in the HEAD!'
Reply #73 - May 15th, 2019 at 6:10pm
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Limey. wrote on May 14th, 2019 at 5:35pm:
At least dumb bells aren't armchair genocidal maniacs.


Oh, I see. You're trying to drag Jasmine into this thread. Good luck with that.

  

 
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Re: 'We will HIT you in the HEAD!'
Reply #74 - May 15th, 2019 at 6:14pm
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Ulysses wrote on May 15th, 2019 at 6:10pm:
Oh, I see. You're trying to drag Jasmine into this thread. Good luck with that.


Wow.
  


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Limey.
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Re: 'We will HIT you in the HEAD!'
Reply #75 - May 15th, 2019 at 6:48pm
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Jasmine wrote on May 15th, 2019 at 6:14pm:
Wow.



He's got a point.

You are extremely heavy.
  

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Re: 'We will HIT you in the HEAD!'
Reply #76 - May 15th, 2019 at 6:49pm
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Limey. wrote on May 15th, 2019 at 6:48pm:
He's got a point.

You are extremely heavy.

I don't get that one.
  


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Re: 'We will HIT you in the HEAD!'
Reply #77 - May 15th, 2019 at 7:14pm
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Limey. wrote on May 15th, 2019 at 5:14pm:
You entirely misunderstand.


The actions of the Iranian state, like those of Irish criminal terrorists,  are wicked and beyond any forgiveness.


The reasons for these actions are complex,  and include the representation,  and misrepresentation,  of historical events.

Don't get me started on the bollocks the Irish Republican wankers spout.... we'll be here weeks.


However,  the kernels of truth are there.

In our, British,  case, there's never been any denial,  at least not for a couple of centuries,  that brutality was an element in English control of Ireland.

It's far, far more complicated than that.  But the honesty is there, the stark facts of Cromwell's methods aren't denied.


I'm bringing up, on this thread,  the disconnect between American public understanding of recent relevant history and Iranian public understanding of recent relevant history.


You'll note that I'm not ascribing blame, justice,  right,  wrong; simply pointing out that overthrow of elected leaders, not long after violent invasions, can rile people up.


You are probably right...I'm extrapolating your position or statement beyond what you mean and perhaps you are doing the same with my statement...so we seem far apart when the truth is we are probably much closer together...I'm not saying these events did not happen...just offering there are many other factors at play way way way beyond the us and britains involvement...

I think (no, I know) I have a tendency to bite back hard when I think someone is monday morning quarterbacking a past event...it's tough to know exactly all the decision points at that moment in time that led the US/Britain to do what they did...

and in general I am so impressed at how western civilization has been able to get past major atrocities committed against each other in the past 200+ years, that when I hear (not that you said this, I'm generalizing) that some islamic terrorist blew up 20 people because someone took someone's goat 200 years ago I have little patience for anyone that rationalizes the bad behavior on long ago often trivial events.
  
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Limey.
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Re: 'We will HIT you in the HEAD!'
Reply #78 - May 15th, 2019 at 7:36pm
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Jasmine wrote on May 15th, 2019 at 6:49pm:
I don't get that one.



Trying to drag you... extremely heavy....
  

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Re: 'We will HIT you in the HEAD!'
Reply #79 - May 15th, 2019 at 8:05pm
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Archie wrote on May 14th, 2019 at 10:53pm:
Sono molto più intelligenti di te di sicuro. Ti chiamerebbero un asino da cavalli.


Mi piacciono gli italiani, ma le mafie sono stupide teste di merda che danno all'Italia un brutto nom.
  

 
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