Liberty News Forum
Political News Forum - Let your opinions be heard on current news and politics. Not for wimps!
Political Opinion Page - Recent Posts - LNF Forums LNF in the Age of Empowerment! Algorithm free!
Christian Forum - Religion Forum - Entertainment - Sports Forum
Military - A1 News Page - Computers Tech - Financial News - Bunker - Rasmussen Presidential Tracking Poll
The House - Off the Wall News - Page 2 - Rasmussen Reports Polls - Chat Room
Liberty News ForumLNF Forums HerePolitical Opinion Page - The Hot Seat › reparations - how far back does blame go...
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 ... 3 4 [5] 6  Send TopicPrint
Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) reparations - how far back does blame go... (Read 591 times)
crepe05
LNF Speaker
LNF Bunker
*****
Online

I Love Liberty News Forum!

Posts: 28,362
Location: Louisiana
Joined: Feb 25th, 2012
Gender: Female
Re: reparations - how far back does blame go...
Reply #40 - Jul 10th, 2019 at 11:59am
Print Post  
Freon_Bale wrote on Jul 10th, 2019 at 11:38am:
You are a Christian, so you can't possibly understand what it means to be Jewish. I've tried to explain to the likes of Seawolf, but coming from the perspective that if you don't believe in your book, you're a bad Christian, my message goes in one ear, out the other.

And based on your attitude, I doubt you would believe anything I said, as if my perspective was a minority within my culture and religion.

So again, really no point explaining to you, except to say, you're wrong if you think book belief is what makes a good Jew. It has zero to do with it, and in fact, you miss the point of being Jewish completely.


I didn't think you could explain it.  I didn't say that book belief makes a good Jew, but it certainly can help to explain the belief of anyone of any religion.  Before the printing press was invented, men (and yes, they were always men) memorized religious writings, word for word, and wrote them down so they would never be lost nor changed.

I assume you know that the first part of the Holy Bible is called the Old Testament, which is the writings of the Jews and begins,  "In the beginning....".  The Second Book of the Bible is called the New Testament and is about Jesus Christ (or Jesus the Christ, if you prefer) and is the tenets of Christianity.

You seem to paint all people with whom you don't agree with the same brush.  I am not Seawolf or anyone else on the board.  I do my own thing, disagree with whom I want to express my disagreement, and don't make judgements against someone unless I have dealt with them.  You claim you tried to explain something with Seawolf, and because he didn't agree with what you said, then neither will I.  Could be, and maybe not.  Frankly, I don't care anymore and not interested, so you needn't bother.   Smiley

The Jews were and are strong people, and have been mistreated, sometimes brutally, throughout history, and yet they have survived it all.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Freon_Bale
LNF Representative2
LNF Bunker
***
Offline

Courage is fearing something,
then doing it anyway

Posts: 2,832
Joined: Feb 16th, 2017
Re: reparations - how far back does blame go...
Reply #41 - Jul 10th, 2019 at 12:13pm
Print Post  
crepe05 wrote on Jul 10th, 2019 at 11:59am:
I didn't think you could explain it.  I didn't say that book belief makes a good Jew, but it certainly can help to explain the belief of anyone of any religion.  Before the printing press was invented, men (and yes, they were always men) memorized religious writings, word for word, and wrote them down so they would never be lost nor changed.

I assume you know that the first part of the Holy Bible is called the Old Testament, which is the writings of the Jews and begins,  "In the beginning....".  The Second Book of the Bible is called the New Testament and is about Jesus Christ (or Jesus the Christ, if you prefer) and is the tenets of Christianity.

You seem to paint all people with whom you don't agree with the same brush.  I am not Seawolf or anyone else on the board.  I do my own thing, disagree with whom I want to express my disagreement, and don't make judgements against someone unless I have dealt with them.  You claim you tried to explain something with Seawolf, and because he didn't agree with what you said, then neither will I.  Could be, and maybe not.  Frankly, I don't care anymore and not interested, so you needn't bother.   Smiley

The Jews were and are strong people, and have been mistreated, sometimes brutally, throughout history, and yet they have survived it all.


That is a fair retort, and I apologize for painting you with the same brush. I have a doctor's appt today, and am not allowed my normal caffeine nostrum, so I may not be working at full capacity right now.

We actually call the 'old' testament, THE Testament, because to do otherwise, would be to acknowledge that second book.

And you are only partially accurate in your description of the passing down of what we call 'the oral tradition'. The Torah has been copied in the same way, by hand, by a specially trained Rabbi, for as long as we can remember. But the oral tradition, and more importantly, the interpretation of the Torah, is what Jews live by, not by the Torah itself. A good Jew is one who does NOT accept the Torah at face value, but argues it continuously with other scholars. It is the argumentation itself, the trying to discern G-d's meaning, that is the obligation of each Jew.

I respect your desire to be fed up with me, so I will go no further, and again, I do apologize for being an ass.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
crepe05
LNF Speaker
LNF Bunker
*****
Online

I Love Liberty News Forum!

Posts: 28,362
Location: Louisiana
Joined: Feb 25th, 2012
Gender: Female
Re: reparations - how far back does blame go...
Reply #42 - Jul 11th, 2019 at 5:59am
Print Post  
Freon_Bale wrote on Jul 10th, 2019 at 12:13pm:
That is a fair retort, and I apologize for painting you with the same brush. I have a doctor's appt today, and am not allowed my normal caffeine nostrum, so I may not be working at full capacity right now.

We actually call the 'old' testament, THE Testament, because to do otherwise, would be to acknowledge that second book.

And you are only partially accurate in your description of the passing down of what we call 'the oral tradition'. The Torah has been copied in the same way, by hand, by a specially trained Rabbi, for as long as we can remember. But the oral tradition, and more importantly, the interpretation of the Torah, is what Jews live by, not by the Torah itself. A good Jew is one who does NOT accept the Torah at face value, but argues it continuously with other scholars. It is the argumentation itself, the trying to discern G-d's meaning, that is the obligation of each Jew.

I respect your desire to be fed up with me, so I will go no further, and again, I do apologize for being an ass.


Thanks for the information.  Very interesting.  However, no apology was needed although it's always appreciated.   One comment you made is not correct, at least I didn't mean to give that impression.  I have no desire to be fed up with you.

Coffee good.  Lack of coffee bad.  Hope the doc appointment went well or goes well.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
LadyBug
LNF Senior Staffer3
LNF Bunker
**
Online

Hey Everybody! Good to
be back. (I hope!)

Posts: 303
Location: PA
Joined: Feb 13th, 2019
Gender: Female
Re: reparations - how far back does blame go...
Reply #43 - Jul 11th, 2019 at 7:01am
Print Post  
I'm just wondering, if this reparations idiocy passes, will everyone in the US have to undergo DNA testing to prove that their ancestors were actually slaves; and, on the other side, that their ancestors were actually slave owners? A supremely monumental undertaking I'm thinking. Or will they just lump everyone into two categories, black receivers and white givers?

My grandparents on both sides didn't arrive in this country until after 1900 and they became a coal miner and a steel worker respectively. Most people, even those here during the years of slavery, never owned slaves. Many were actively involved in ending slavery, even at the expense of their own lives. If that's not a high enough price to pay, I don't know what is.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
crepe05
LNF Speaker
LNF Bunker
*****
Online

I Love Liberty News Forum!

Posts: 28,362
Location: Louisiana
Joined: Feb 25th, 2012
Gender: Female
Re: reparations - how far back does blame go...
Reply #44 - Jul 11th, 2019 at 7:33am
Print Post  
LadyBug wrote on Jul 11th, 2019 at 7:01am:
I'm just wondering, if this reparations idiocy passes, will everyone in the US have to undergo DNA testing to prove that their ancestors were actually slaves; and, on the other side, that their ancestors were actually slave owners? A supremely monumental undertaking I'm thinking. Or will they just lump everyone into two categories, black receivers and white givers?

My grandparents on both sides didn't arrive in this country until after 1900 and they became a coal miner and a steel worker respectively. Most people, even those here during the years of slavery, never owned slaves. Many were actively involved in ending slavery, even at the expense of their own lives. If that's not a high enough price to pay, I don't know what is.


The way politics work, at least recently, if you "look" white, then you will be classified as white.  If you "look" black, then you will be classified as black.   Dems own the House where legislation originates, and they see everything as racial or racist.

I don't think that racism will ever cease to exist since it's the only play that the dems have in their political playbook.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Freon_Bale
LNF Representative2
LNF Bunker
***
Offline

Courage is fearing something,
then doing it anyway

Posts: 2,832
Joined: Feb 16th, 2017
Re: reparations - how far back does blame go...
Reply #45 - Jul 11th, 2019 at 9:42am
Print Post  
LadyBug wrote on Jul 11th, 2019 at 7:01am:
I'm just wondering, if this reparations idiocy passes, will everyone in the US have to undergo DNA testing to prove that their ancestors were actually slaves; and, on the other side, that their ancestors were actually slave owners? A supremely monumental undertaking I'm thinking. Or will they just lump everyone into two categories, black receivers and white givers?

My grandparents on both sides didn't arrive in this country until after 1900 and they became a coal miner and a steel worker respectively. Most people, even those here during the years of slavery, never owned slaves. Many were actively involved in ending slavery, even at the expense of their own lives. If that's not a high enough price to pay, I don't know what is.


I don't think reparations is looked at as a personal obligation, but one of our whole nation. Like Germany making reparations to Jews, reparations (or at least the attempt at such) is a way for a country to acknowledge its sins, and try to make things right.

And as much as I would appreciate a financial bump, it would have no impact, imo, on systemic racism. Addressing this kind of racism by creating symbols that made me feel inclusive, like Tubman on the $20, would have far more symbolic and long-lasting impact. Removal of statues that celebrate slavery, or at least moving them to museums that raise awareness of our guilty past, would be more appropriate than paying people off.

This brings up a good point, however. Does the modern generation of a country have to take responsibility for a country's past? I am hearing from you conservatives, that the answer is no, and from others, yes. Does each generation of a country get a blank slate?

I say we DO need to take responsibility for our country's past actions. Otherwise, we are just a bunch of people who happen to live near each other under the same laws within the same borders. To BE American, means to accept all that got us here, both good and bad, and to own both.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
AmericanMom
LNF Party Leader
LNF Bunker
***
Offline

I Love Liberty News Forum!

Posts: 4,763
Location: Oregon
Joined: Jul 4th, 2012
Gender: Female
Re: reparations - how far back does blame go...
Reply #46 - Jul 11th, 2019 at 9:58am
Print Post  
Freon_Bale wrote on Jul 11th, 2019 at 9:42am:
I don't think reparations is looked at as a personal obligation, but one of our whole nation. Like Germany making reparations to Jews, reparations (or at least the attempt at such) is a way for a country to acknowledge its sins, and try to make things right.

And as much as I would appreciate a financial bump, it would have no impact, imo, on systemic racism. Addressing this kind of racism by creating symbols that made me feel inclusive, like Tubman on the $20, would have far more symbolic and long-lasting impact. Removal of statues that celebrate slavery, or at least moving them to museums that raise awareness of our guilty past, would be more appropriate than paying people off.

This brings up a good point, however. Does the modern generation of a country have to take responsibility for a country's past? I am hearing from you conservatives, that the answer is no, and from others, yes. Does each generation of a country get a blank slate?

I say we DO need to take responsibility for our country's past actions. Otherwise, we are just a bunch of people who happen to live near each other under the same laws within the same borders. To BE American, means to accept all that got us here, both good and bad, and to own both.



But the nation as a whole wont have to pay,..
The left is selecting a group of people to receive a payment, they wont be taxed like everyone else to make that payment.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Wally Wants A Wall
Hardhat
Conservative Caucus
*****
Offline

Cunning... is but the
low mimic of wisdom ~Plato

Posts: 27,877
Location: Upstate New York
Joined: Feb 24th, 2008
Gender: Male
Re: reparations - how far back does blame go...
Reply #47 - Jul 11th, 2019 at 10:08am
Print Post  
I detest the freeloading bums who want to use the government to steal from those who have worked hard to earn what they have.  Socialism Sucks and "Reparations" is only another one of the many vehicles they attempt to use to pick the pockets of others!
Time for a referendum on the future direction of America; Re-elect President Trump!
(AND THROW THE SOCIALIST BUMS OUT OF OFFICE!)

  

" The few will always act like the few.�

�Machiavelli

“When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser.”

― Socrates

img]https://i.imgur.com/prBnexU.jpg[/img]
Back to top
WWWAIM  
IP Logged
 
Freon_Bale
LNF Representative2
LNF Bunker
***
Offline

Courage is fearing something,
then doing it anyway

Posts: 2,832
Joined: Feb 16th, 2017
Re: reparations - how far back does blame go...
Reply #48 - Jul 11th, 2019 at 10:23am
Print Post  
AmericanMom wrote on Jul 11th, 2019 at 9:58am:
But the nation as a whole wont have to pay,..
The left is selecting a group of people to receive a payment, they wont be taxed like everyone else to make that payment.


Is that an opinion, or can you support it with a link to proposed legislation.

And you are not addressing my point. SHOULD WE, as a nation, take responsibility for our past? Or do we just say, 'Hey, that was a hundred years ago, I didn't do it, so let's just forget it happened'.

Your comment is more about HOW we deal with reparations, not IF we should deal with them.
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Freon_Bale
LNF Representative2
LNF Bunker
***
Offline

Courage is fearing something,
then doing it anyway

Posts: 2,832
Joined: Feb 16th, 2017
Re: reparations - how far back does blame go...
Reply #49 - Jul 11th, 2019 at 10:26am
Print Post  
Wally Wants A Wall wrote on Jul 11th, 2019 at 10:08am:
I detest the freeloading bums who want to use the government to steal from those who have worked hard to earn what they have.  Socialism Sucks and "Reparations" is only another one of the many vehicles they attempt to use to pick the pockets of others!
Time for a referendum on the future direction of America; Re-elect President Trump!
(AND THROW THE SOCIALIST BUMS OUT OF OFFICE!)

https://i.imgur.com/prBnexU.jpg


Hallelujah, brother!

Just like Trump making the NATO countries pay more for protection they are leeching off the wealthier U.S., so too, should you poor ass states cough up more money for the protection that my taxes, in a wealthier state, are paying for YOUR protection.

STOP MOOCHING OFF MY STATE'S SUCCESS, you free-loading bum hypocrite!
  
Back to top
 
IP Logged
 
Page Index Toggle Pages: 1 ... 3 4 [5] 6 
Send TopicPrint
 
Liberty News ForumLNF Forums HerePolitical Opinion Page - The Hot Seat › reparations - how far back does blame go...

LNF Home - Political Opinion Page
LNF Forums

Christian Forum - Religion Forum - Sports Forum - Entertainment - House
Military, History - Cooking and Crafts - Creative Writing
Off the Wall News - Science Forum - Tech Gadgets - Financial News - Humor
Bunker - Page 2 - Page 3 - Page 4 - Chat Room





Drudge Report - News Max - Rush Limbaugh - FrontpageMag
Advertise on the LNF - Twitter LNF - LNF Archive - LNF News
LNF Blog
News and Political Links
Political Blogs
Add your website or blog
Political Columnists
Political Humor
A1 News Page
David Limbaugh
Political Frog
Conservatives Directory
President Trump Approval Poll
Presidential Party Election Poll News forum posting, privacy policy and member rules