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Liberty News ForumLNF Forums HerePolitical Opinion Page - The Hot Seat › Sick Canadians: Drop dead, or head to US
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Very Hot Topic (More than 25 Replies) Sick Canadians: Drop dead, or head to US (Read 391 times)
Ulysses
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Re: Sick Canadians: Drop dead, or head to US
Reply #20 - Jul 10th, 2019 at 2:43pm
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patrick2 wrote on Jul 10th, 2019 at 1:18pm:
WHY don't they have health insurance?  Why don't they get their ass out and earn some money and BUY some??

This is the problem with liberalism in lots of ways - it wants to rig ALL of society to cater to the WORST people - the lazy, druggy, juicers, irresponsible.


Let's see: try working for minimum wage when you're in your 60's and afford health insurance. It will eat up 50% or more of your gross pay. Leaving basically nothing for food, rent, clothing, etc.

OK, so you say, scrap the ACA and go to low cost health insurance that doesn't have to meet the ACA's requirements. Great! As soon as you get really sick, you'll be bankrupted by medical bills, because your low-cost non-ACA compliant joke health insurance doesn't cover major medical and/or the cost of prescription drugs. Or you will be denied coverage because the insurance company bean counters will determine that yours is a "pre-existing condition".

Universal healthcare is coming to America, because it's the right thing to do.

  

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forgotten centrist
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Re: Sick Canadians: Drop dead, or head to US
Reply #21 - Jul 10th, 2019 at 2:45pm
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patrick2 wrote on Jul 10th, 2019 at 2:29pm:
"Access" is one of those deliberately blurring political terms of the leftwing.  Their "access" means they have to wait 3 months for an MRI.  Meanwhile, if they have cancer, it gets a good head start while they're waiting,  waiting, waiting - with their "access".


If that were happening, they wouldn't keep consistently outscoring us on healthcare outcomes.
  

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Re: Sick Canadians: Drop dead, or head to US
Reply #22 - Jul 10th, 2019 at 2:49pm
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Ulysses wrote on Jul 10th, 2019 at 2:43pm:
Let's see: try working for minimum wage when you're in your 60's and afford health insurance. It will eat up 50% or more of your gross pay. Leaving basically nothing for food, rent, clothing, etc.






How is it someone is working for minimum wage when they're 60?  I did that when I was 17.  That's what minimum wage jobs are reasonably for - introduce teenagers to the work world.  Why is someone doing that at 60?  Didn't they go to university or learn a trade?  Why not?  They lived six decades and couldn't get farther than that?
  
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Re: Sick Canadians: Drop dead, or head to US
Reply #23 - Jul 10th, 2019 at 2:50pm
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forgotten centrist wrote on Jul 10th, 2019 at 2:45pm:
If that were happening, they wouldn't keep consistently outscoring us on healthcare outcomes.


International healthcare "outcomes", as just about everyone knows, is a typically rigged "statistic".  Grin
  
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Re: Sick Canadians: Drop dead, or head to US
Reply #24 - Jul 10th, 2019 at 2:54pm
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patrick2 wrote on Jul 10th, 2019 at 2:29pm:
"Access" is one of those deliberately blurring political terms of the leftwing.  Their "access" means they have to wait 3 months for an MRI.  Meanwhile, if they have cancer, it gets a good head start while they're waiting,  waiting, waiting - with their "access".


That is actually not true. 

https://www.cnn.com/2018/06/01/health/us-canada-health-care-spending-study/index...

Greg
  

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Re: Sick Canadians: Drop dead, or head to US
Reply #25 - Jul 10th, 2019 at 5:51pm
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A good read.

The cost of universal coverage, at least in the Canadian model, can and does result in longer wait times for certain procedures.
  

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Re: Sick Canadians: Drop dead, or head to US
Reply #26 - Jul 10th, 2019 at 6:23pm
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forgotten centrist wrote on Jul 10th, 2019 at 2:45pm:
If that were happening, they wouldn't keep consistently outscoring us on healthcare outcomes.


"Outcomes" is pretty vague and broad, not to mention subjective, especially when considering relative weight of certain outcomes.  For example, how would they measure the outcomes in two situations in which one person gets a hip replacement a week after a diagnosed need and another gets it 6 months later?  Would that be scored as an equal outcome?
  
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Re: Sick Canadians: Drop dead, or head to US
Reply #27 - Jul 10th, 2019 at 7:53pm
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Mojo-Jojo wrote on Jul 10th, 2019 at 5:51pm:
A good read.

The cost of universal coverage, at least in the Canadian model, can and does result in longer wait times for certain procedures.



The lonnnnnnng wait times for Canadians is well-documented with many references, including the ones I've already given from Canadian sources.
  
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Re: Sick Canadians: Drop dead, or head to US
Reply #28 - Jul 10th, 2019 at 11:22pm
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Mojo-Jojo wrote on Jul 10th, 2019 at 5:51pm:
A good read.

The cost of universal coverage, at least in the Canadian model, can and does result in longer wait times for certain procedures.


The closest honest comparison would be for wait times for similar procedures in an American HMO system.

Example: I'm in an HMO. I broke my wrist in the middle of May. I had to wait for two weeks to get an appointment in Orthopedics. And even then, the most I could get was to see a PA (Physician's Assistant), not an actual Orthopedic surgeon. Meanwhile I was misdiagnosed in the Urgent Care department and put into a splint for two weeks. Once the PA did a physical exam, he prescribed a full cast for another month. Had I been seen in Orthopedics initially, chances are I would have been put into a full cast immediately and my recovery would have gone better.

This is the reality of managed health care (HMO) in America today. While I may grumble about it, it's certainly better than no health care at all, which in America is the alternative for many.

Now, the procedure mentioned in the OP is bleeding edge medicine: stem cell transplants to cure cancer. It's not surprising there would be a long wait for that in the Canadian universal health care system. But I'm sure the vast majority of health care outcomes in the Canadian system are positive and far better than the American system of "If you or your employer can pay for it, great. If not, too bad, so sad"...

  

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Re: Sick Canadians: Drop dead, or head to US
Reply #29 - Jul 11th, 2019 at 4:27am
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patrick2 wrote on Jul 10th, 2019 at 2:30pm:
What they can dig is their grave if they die waiting for surgery.


Was anybody needing emergency procedures for immediate life threatening situations placed on a wait list? I.e. heart attack, traumatic injury, etc.
  

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